JEFFOS69

I think this car kicks *** looks wise.

http://www.challengertalk.com/forums...?p=945#post945

FuzzyLS BRO

i like it because it's ol skool looking

LivinLow

I like it because it actualy looks like the actual challenger,Not some cheap imitation they've been producing latly.

Buff4Prez Yo

iTrader: (2)

i'm glad they went with a nostalgic look for it...with they did it with the charger

i hope they do the same thing and bring out the Dart

Greco

that cars looks plan mean... I like it.

Blue Dragon

Instead of looking towards the future, why are american car companies looking back. Those days are past, its no wonder both Ford and GM are almost bankrupt with their stock rated as junk.

its me.. mario

OH HELL YEAH!

WildoutWhiteGSR

Everything on it looks sick...I just say change the rims.

That is all

tdot2gteg

i've always liked the challenger. one of my favourite muscle cars. put it as my fav in the favourite ride thread. my dad had a TA back in his days when it was new. had an AAR cuda too. another favourite. i like the remake. looks like the oprginal and modern at the same time.

DreadKnight

Can't wait for it. It looks mean.

SIC1

+1

but you have to look at WHY they are doing it... They know the drones of north american baby boomers out there who can't buy the 50's/60's/760's version of these muscle cars. They can get the retro version & nostalgia today (although reliability can make or break a product no matter what it looks like over time)

Blue Dragon

^^ So lets look at the cars that were retro and flopped. Start with the ford Thunderbid, followed by the PT cruiser. I am waiting to see what happens with the dodge powered hemi cars (excluding the 300C).

WildoutWhiteGSR

The PT Cruiser is successful...

The thunderbird was a joke...reminded me of team-america...

JEFFOS69

SO far most of the retro inspired cars are doing fairly well right now. The reason GM and FORD are not doing as well is yes because of sales but more so because of union problems. But Wayne likes to bash american companies so its good for him to do so.

Also the reason that the companies are going this way because its a new market segment to go into with very few competitors because what can Toyota or Honda go retro with their car styles? No because if they do they will come out with a small shittly looking box car that has 78hp lol. or the jdm sweet old school acura legend with the chain license plate surround or old box honda accord with the same plate thing. But really its a smart move in terms of being a leader in a market segemnt as well as limiting your competitors. If any of the imports tried to go the same route they would not be able to. Also there is market demand for these cars (esp this new one since it looks so similar to the old one) since people like the muscle cars but cannot deal with the unreliability of an old old car and they lack some of the new technology or refinement that is found in new cars - this way they get both. Its not stupid its smart business - its cornering a market segment.

Platinum Playa

^Good Point, Jeff.
Wayne is a bash artist!

Blue Dragon

Jeff, its not just because of the unions. Ford and GM had to resort to employee pricing to actually sell cars. The Honda civic has surpassed the Ford F150 as the best selling vehicle in Canada, and the Accord and Camary surpassed the Taurus a long time ago. I can still remember when the Taurus was the best selling family car.

Then there's the point of the unions, huge health care costs, and pension benefits. You have to remember that any foreign (and I say that loosely) car manufacturer has unions too, so why are they not saddled with the same problems that GM and Ford have?

If you want to call my refusal to ever buy a domestic car bashing, then so be it. I had a bad experience with my first car, a Chevy Beretta GTZ, and vowed that I would never ever buy a domestic again.

JEFFOS69

Wayne its quite obvious from anyone looking into your posts regarding american companies that you are the 1st to jump in with a negative comment about them but thats cool its your opinion and youre entitled to it.

As for the unions the unions that the other car manufactures have is quite different than the ones that GM and Ford have since they have been around for much longer so rules promises and regulations are very different between the 2 - in turn now these dealing in the past are hurting the 2 companies in the long run. I also agree with you that alot of the domestic products are not on par with their competitors counterparts and that hurts sales as well no doubt.

As for the f150 losing as #1 car in canada its still the #1 truck in north america and if you have ever driven experienced one compared to its competitors you can see why. I also would make an educated guess that the honda civic would surpass it in sales since not that many familys drive trucks, gas prices are higher and civics are priced far lower than the trucks these days with the truck constantly adding more features and options resulting in a higher cost.

There is also the stigma about domestic cars being reliable and non domestics being the most reliable cars in the world causing sales to drop - there are alot of uninformed people in the world out there (as we all come across them everyday) Its just the way domestic car companies handle problems compared to some pf the imports. How about audi, VW and electrical problems, mercedes shitty quality, BMW and their known problems(cough cough 7 series is a good example) ferrari and their unreliable cars etc etc? No one seems to give a ---- but theyre out there too. Not saying there arent unreliable domestics as well believe me there are but its just funny that people assume because its a domestic its unreliable and thats hurting sales - the media doesnt help as well - rememeber all the new 06 civics coming and having gas pedal problems? Not many people really knw about that one. I for one am glad companies call recalls instead of denying a problem (like honda and their trannies back in the day "ug what tranny problem?") since its better for the consumer. Just because a car doesnt have that many recalls (and trust me all car co. do) doesnt mean that car is problem free or reliable you have to go by each model not where it comes from.


Anyways bottom line is we are talking about why the domestic car companies are going retro - its because its working, bringing in sales and the imports cant really do it so they have the market cornered in this segment and the more market segments you can dominate the better you can do for yourself when you're a company that has so many products out there.

Blue Dragon

Jeff, a lot of foreign car manufacturers have been around for a long time too, so its not just the domestics with long term unions.

Yes, domestic trucks, especially work trucks are still the best, but the imports are getting closer and closer, and will eventually take over that market with a superior product, just like they did with cars. Its not just a perception of domestics being unreliable compared to imports, its the truth. The domestics are just starting to catch up, and even then, cars like the 300C are really just a mercedes E class under the skin. Every car has problems, but if you look at any report such as JD power, domestics have way more problems than imports.

Going retro is shortsighted, sure they can corner the market, but its a niche market, and while the imports continue to innovate, the retro fad will past, and the domestics will have no new products to compete with. There are exceptions, the corvette, the caddy CTS-V etc, but generally speaking, imports better than their domestic counterparts.

Here is consmer reports best and worst used cars http://www.consumerreports.org/cro/c...worst-1205.htm

JEFFOS69

No substance behind the part where you just assume that the imports will take over the truck market - you do realize the domestic companies know that they have people gunning for them in this (ie toyota) and continue to innovate as well. Dont assume. Also the only one that is close is Toyota and theyve always been 3rd place no doubt they make a quality product though.

Also Ford had the 1st auto union and both GM and Ford has unions and assembly lines far before most of the other companies.

Also JD Power and Associates is just a market research company that surveys owners of new cars. Your BMW burning out a light = problem and A wheel falling off another car = a problem but the problem could be weighted the same even though one is more serious.

Also going retro is not shorts sighted - theyre not doing this with all their cars just a select few. Like I said its market entry into an untapped market.

JD power means nothing theyr just an expensive survey company. I do this stuff for school.

Also VW and Audi are imports and they have been one of the most unreliable cars on the road for the last 5+ years but then again eneducated people will think theyre good because they like the interior. And theyre german - they dont realize that german companies seem to have problems all the time with their electricals.

JEFFOS69

Re consumer reports just for information purposes:

Ford Crown Victoria
Ford Escort
Mustang (V8)

These are the top rated cars - according to people that just assume these would have been unreliable.

Edit like I always say go by car model not by who makes it but then again people are stupid and I have to deal with them everyday one of the reasons Im getting out of retail branch banking and moving to corporate so I can deal with less public idiots. (not speaking of you Wayne but those who are uneducated about what they "think" they know)

Blue Dragon

I agree with you on German cars not being the reliability standard that they were considered to be in the late 80's, early 90's, but the Japanese cars are indeed that reliability standard. You pick the survey, any survey or study, and you'll see that the Japanese are ahead in terms of quality, overall.

Expensive survey company or not, this is one of the things that influences buyers

JEFFOS69

Oh I know trust me like I said I specialized in marketing in school and work with companies doing so. Its all about what sells the products but you and I know better and realize what makes and car good and what does not and wont let a stupid survey tell us otherwise - but people are not like us and follow these things leading to believeing a stereotype and leading to lower sales for NA carmakers

On the whole are japanese cars more reliable than domestic - yes

Are domestics unreliable - no

All all imports reliable - no

Dolechy596

now thats what i'm talkin about.....I love the retro designs....man...it almost makes me want a domestic

Kordaek

Wayne; there isn't much doubting that some of these rehashes have been part of the reason that the Daihmler-Chrystler group acctually made out with a 1 percent sales increase *domestically*, despite Ford and GM 8 and 12 percent losses accordingly. People have loved the 300C, for instance.

However, I do agree that in same cases it's WAY overboard. Furthermore, I think that Ford and GM's designs in general simply leave too much to be desired; they're midsized are boring as all hell, and the chevy line of compacts and subcompacts are uninspiring to boot. They both have a long *** way to go, if they hope to return to profitability - starting with some models that capture the zietgeist of their times - like the mustang of old.

The problem is further aggravated by the massive health-care costs that are UNIQUE in the united states auto industry, and United states in general. Attempts to offset these costs and come to acceptable standards for both parties have been thwarted on many angles by Domestic Unions, which are renowned for their fierce stance and low ability to comprimise.

Even as the bulk of the issue lay in the court of the Big 3, so to does it lie in the court of those who work and supply for them.