Changing from Honda MTF worth it? Answered. Updated Nov. 29/05
 

Honda MTF

First impression. Felt good. Driving was ok. Nothing really stood out, but nothing was really wrong either. Good overall fluid. I had it put in, when I got my new clutch installed. It was in for a total of 5 months with no auto-x event's just street driving. About 10,000kms on the Honda MTF. When the Honda MTF was drained, it came out clean, with no metal particle's that could be seen with the naked eye. I started to develop a 5th gear grind when shifting from 4th to 5th at high rpms. It wasn't a bad grind. It still went into gear and held perfectly. Still bothered me somewhat. This was used in the winter and summer climates.

Decided to try GM Syncromesh (Not Friction Modified). Worked well, got rid of that 5th gear grind. Shifting overall was a lot smoother. Getting into first was a lot easier same with reverse. Overall everything was made more fluid and easier shifting. Just the overall fun of driving came back again. I had the GM Syncromesh (Not Friction Modified) in for about another 5-6 months. About 10,000-15,000km's on this fluid. I did auto-x about 6 times on this fluid. Held up at the track, but it seemed by the end of the day of auto-x, it would be harder than normal to shift, but as soon as the fluid cooled down, it worked well. So on the street it was good. This fluid came out like a used fluid should, darker, but not dirty, no metal particle's were in the fluid to worry about. This was also used in the winter and summer climates.

Now I am currently trying Motul 300 Gear fluid.

Overall first impression is that there is no problem at all getting into reverse. Went straight in. Better than the GM Syncromesh. Overall the gears feel the same as the GM syncromesh in terms of shifting on the street. At the track, it held up a lot better than the GM syncromesh. Worked really well at the auto-x. Street driving GM Syncromesh and the Motul are the same. Haven't had the motul in long enough, but will updated my posted as the weeks go by for overall long term driving characteristics.

great review. always wanted to see how motul 300 gear fluid held up..

I really liked the GM friction modified fluid. I had rebuilt my tranny a year earlier, replaching the 3rd gear and synchro, but then the grind started to come back. The GM stuff cured the grind at high RPM

yeah i used the gm fluid as well for my cable tranny and it fixed my grinds no problem.
i was debating about getting the motul oil. let me know how that goes. i'm due for a tranny fluid change soon.

Would the GM or Motul work on automatic Trannys as well as Manual, is it worth using it instead of Honda ATF?

I'm pretty sure autos and manuals use a different type of fluid. I know manual fluid is based on engine oil and if you're ever in a jam, 10W30 will do the job. Not sure what kind of fluid auto uses, just that it's red.

Where did you grab the Motul and how much do you need?

Speedstar in Markham. You need 3 bottles.

www.speedstar.ca

I gotta change my tranny fluid too..first gear and reverse are a bitch to get in sometimes :(

anyone try the redline mtl

Update: Nov. 29/05

So far everything seems good still. No problems have come up and nothing has gotten worse or better. Overall compared to GM syncromesh and Honda MTF it's performance is pretty much the same through out my daily driving. Where I noticed the difference was during auto-x with the consistant shifting up and down through the gears.

The honda MTF and gm syncromesh faired ok for the auto-x task, but as the day went on shifting had gotten worse. That's where the GM syncromesh and Honda MTF disappointed me. The Honda MTF more so than the GM syncromesh.

Now as it has gotten colder the Motul 300v on intial startup is notchy. Once the car has warm up and the tranny fluid has warm up with the car. Shifting goes back to being smooth. My understanding, this is the same with all transmission fluids.

Overall I am happy with the Motul 300v and will update this post when one of the more colder days of winter has come.

Which to buy? If I were to pick a fluid based on my choices now. I'd pick the Motul 300v. It is the most expensive of the bunch, but suits my needs well. Pick your transmission fluid based upon how you use your car. We will see if my mind changes as the weather gets colder.

If I didn't auto-x my car or have no desire to take it to any form of track. The GM Syncromesh works perfectly well.

How do I feel about Honda MTF....well, I don't like it and I think it's crap. It does work, but it doesn't last the way I would like it to. Seems like the bare minimum to just get by.

Background info:
I change my transmission fluid every 8 months so it's barely in there to even get dirty. Every change I have done has been for peace of mind and the fluid always comes out clean.

Any update with the colder months?

hoping to post my opinions on the gm synchromesh...just grabbed 3 bottles today...pretty sure its not the friction modified version...combined with some prothane bushings...can't wait!

During warm up it's still notchy as usual, but it's a lot better once warmed compared to the honda mtf.

I run the honda mtf in my beater and I hate it. I have the gm synromesh non-friction modified in the teg and it works a hell of a lot better, so it's not just in the integra transmission that benefits from it, but in the civic would benefit as well, I'm just to lazy to change it over since it's so new. The teg got another change to gm syncomesh in around november 06 and the civic got honda mtf in december 06, so the fluid being old isn't a problem.

Both my cars are driven in winter.

PS. Honda has a new tranny fluid out for 07. I just may try it out when it gets warmer.

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v2...ewHondaMTF.jpg

I had to crop that part out of the full PDF file, there was other things in it unrelated to tranny fluid.

Tis a good thread.

Thanks for the update,

So you went from Honda to GM non-reducer to Mobul BACK to GM non-reducer?

What changed that you decided to go back to the not-as-good-track-performance-fluid?

Price was the biggest factor, the motul was about $68 for three bottles, while the gm sycromesh was around $35 and the honda mtf like $28.

Also the Motul worked best in the summer months as long as the temperature was above 5 degree's. As it got colder the performance would get worse, on the really cold days like today -16 it sucked, required to slow your shifting speed just a bit in order to get engage the gears as smoothly.

The honda MTF was sub par in the cold and absolutly sucked when it was too hot or anything that required a lot of shifting ie auto-x, stop and go traffic.

The gm syncromesh offer the best of both worlds, I never got it to over-heat, even though it was worse than the motul, it was still up there and in winter was better than both the motul and honda mtf for less money.


The reason why I haven't tried the friction modified version of the gm syncromesh is because platty p and I changed ours back to back. He used the gm syncromesh friction modified and I used the normal stuff, I couldn't tell a difference between the two. Don't put to much thought into it though, I only got to drive it for maybe 5 minutes, so no everyday use/auto/x was put on it.

That and a couple of people on honda-tech have been saying over time the friction modified stuff my damage your lsd and cause it to make noise, but since I don't have one yet it wasn't an issue

Next I'll probably try the new 07 honda mtf in the integra and gm syncromesh friction modified on the civic.

the honda mtl is like $8.xx per litre, the synchromesh is like $9.xx per litre...

will post my opinions tomorrow on synchromesh

Honda MTL $8.00 x 3 = $24 plus tax = $27.60
GM Syncromesh $10 x 3 = $30 plus tax = $34.50

:finger:


And I thought I was bad doing an oil change yesterday. Today's even colder, but post up your findings.

thats a quote i got...but i pad $24.xx for 3 litres of syncromesh =)

I ran the GM FM stuff for a year without any tranny problems in an ITR tranny with LSD.

well with the new prothane bushings, and the synchromesh....i can say there is definate improvement...bushings made me actually feel like im shifting into a gear again...

the mtl is making shifting smoother...im diggin it...shifting did get better after it warmed up a bit...but we will see when climate is warmer....

i do notice some grindage when i try to bang it into third...but obviously that is my 3rd gear...

I've been using Redline MTL and have no problems whatsoever. Shifting is smooth, but I can't comment on how it compares to others.

I used GM syncromesh in my old Talon for about 6 years. Worked quite well, found i had to change quite often to get the max performace. However this fluid is for problem trannies, it can cure grinds and is great for older units, but it does contain a chemical that will eat and wear out syncros and tranny components quite quickly. I would not recommend it for new or non-problematic transmissions.

very good thread t-bag, i'll be getting all new fluids and was wondering what kind to go with. thankfully, i don't have any problems with my trans now so i'm stuck with the "new" honda MTF or the GM syncromesh. if i find the new honda MTF to be just like the old one, i'll swich it out for the syncromesh.

A++ thread..will read again!! haha

after more driving...the shifting feels somewhat notchy, and enhances my 3rd gear notch all when cold...after about 5-10 minutes, the car's shifting feels good!!!

fuzz if you have no issues with your transmission, i wouldn't try it...